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Talk:Soldiers
Layout? This is a fairly ambitious page, but it's one that's needed. I have no idea how you're going to have the final version laid out - so many soldiers, so many criteria for availability - so good luck there. One tiny suggestion is that you don't list arts in detail, since some of the later additions will have have half a dozen arts over two categories. So I think just the basic category would do. It would be nice to see their starting weapon too, and also maybe their unique stat? They should both fit without making it look too overcrowded. As there's no point in having a dedicated page for each soldier (just not enough information to fill it), then there should be as much info on this page as possible. Ferret37 00:55, 4 February 2009 (UTC) :: Okies, the pages for the soldiers that can be hired that are already created will need to be deleted. As for layout... maybe split the page into three different types? A page for each of the races as it'll stop the page from getting too full and make it easier for people to view. Plus maybe just list the art name and link it to it's page? Then we don't need details on one-handed or two-handed etc. Andrealinia970 01:48, 4 February 2009 (UTC) For now I'm just trying to collect the data when it's available. Merthos 09:11, 4 February 2009 (UTC) I can help with this page, I have all soldier's stats available in database, so I can export it here, the thing is do you still want starting ability? that will probably mess this page alot since alot of soldier will have heaps of skills, also the text takes quite alot of screen space...Sarmu 23:43, 4 February 2009 (UTC) ::Um. I know I said as much information as possible, but I don't think this will work. It's just too much. By the time you've scrolled half way down the screen, you've forgotten what the headers are. I'm having the same problem trying to make the Enemy Arts page remotely accessible. ::When people are looking to recruit a soldier, they are generally much less interested in his Mystic Defense stat that in what arts he can use. I'm going to need some convincing that putting in all these numbers (that vary with BR anyway) is worthwhile. ::Ferret37 02:17, 5 February 2009 (UTC) ::::See how you like it now, I'm only putting things I think it's important, I've also Included weapon and accessory of choices. I do think it's a bit crowded, maybe we can separate them into 2 pagesSarmu 02:32, 5 February 2009 (UTC) Availability Do you want to separate the table by when they become available? If so how you guys want the soldier thats join with certain BR be organised? Ideally you want sort the soldier the same way in the game, however they do overlap each other's join condition quite a bit. ::Sorting by tier (the way the game sorts them) is the way to go. ::I like all the data you have, my concern is that anyone new to the game and thinking of hiring for the first time would turn to this page for advice and be really confused. Yeah, we all know know what it means, but there are so many variables in this game that we don't want to be confusing n00bs unless absolutely necessary. ::Ok, here's a proposal for layout. A single page listing all soldiers separated by tier (the way the game separates them), each tier with a toc headline to allow easy access from the top of the page. Each line to list name, race, BR requirement for recruiting, starting class, starting arts, starting weapon and unique stat. Each tier section to carry a link to a more detailed page where we find the bulk of Sarmu's data. ::Opinions, anyone? ::Ferret37 03:09, 5 February 2009 (UTC) ::::I've separated them by tier, the only problem now is you can only sort within the tier. Also BR requirement is not added yet, I'm not sure having a BR column is good idea, since they all require the same BR within the tier, and it will look empty for those that don't need any requirement. but we have to somehow identify who needs BR and who don't. ::::Sarmu 04:12, 5 February 2009 (UTC) :::::: If you use the 'class="sortable" option for the table then it allows people to have the table rearranged how they wish, so then they can resort them by name or class or whatever they're looking for. I think we need a page for each hired person though because that one looks too crowded. Mention their name, race and starting skills on that page and then their individual pages can mention when they're available and their stats etc. ? Andrealinia970 11:33, 5 February 2009 (UTC) Individual Page I think we might need individual page for each hire like Andrealinia suggested, this page is too big for my liking and it takes long time to load on my laptop with IE, also there is lots of information missing in the pages here like initial skills, formation attribute, elemental resistence etc. Sarmu 00:07, 11 February 2009 (UTC) i think a page for each is excessive as well though. is there some other categorization that can be used to make it smaller, yet acessable? starting class? when available? Akuthia 23:52, 10 February 2009 (UTC) ::Class will change so it's not a good idea, probably 1 page for each tier at least, what do others think? Sarmu 00:07, 11 February 2009 (UTC) yes, class will change, but not until after you pick them up, right? so if someone was looking for someone of a particular class, they could search for that class, and see who starts out as it. Once you have the person, its unlikely that you'll need to look them up, right? Akuthia 00:20, 11 February 2009 (UTC) :: I think a page for each hire race would be perfectly acceptable. Not necessarily for each soldier but there are so many that the mitra can have their own page etc. But the class could be mentioned as, like Akuthia said, there's not much need in looking up a soldier you already have hired, unless when you dismiss them, the class stays different? I'm not too sure about how that works. Andrealinia970 00:34, 11 February 2009 (UTC) ::::I'm trying to get my head around the way this needs to be displayed. People at different stages of the game are going to have different hiring options available, and all they're going to want to know is "which soldier is best for me?". ::::Splitting by race doesn't make much sense to me, as it's not really a major consideration in hiring and no one wants to have to look through three pages to make a decision. ::::Arranging by class isn't really much help either as no one, least of all the n00bs (remember them?) really know what classes mean. ::::The only way I can see to split the table is by tier. Yes, that means that there will be ten pages, but to any given person all except one of them will be irrelevant. At the end of the day, users don't want to look at soldiers they can't get yet, or those that they have already discarded. ::::Even then, the table could use some trimming down for accessibility, which I'm reluctant to concede probably means we need a page per soldier too. ::::Ferret37 01:18, 11 February 2009 (UTC). true, we dont know exactly what the classes do, but i think everyone in each class shares atleast some traits amongst themselves, that we could include some how, indicating what their general traits are... Akuthia 01:30, 11 February 2009 (UTC) ::::I don't know, I think the only time anyone's going to be looking down this list by class in the near future is for guild tasks, and if they're looking for Runemaidens or Commanders then let them be disappointed. ::::Class is probably going to be important when (if) we understand it, which is why I think it should stay on the table, but I don't think it's a viable criteria for splitting groups. When I'm hiring my main criteria are arts, and... um... no, sorry, that's it. If I'm looking for an Invoker, I'll start at the bottom of the list, find the first two soldiers with Invocation arts, compare their individual stats and hire the best. ::::Hey, maybe that's the way to split it? ::::Anyone do their hiring any differently? ::::Ferret37 01:58, 11 February 2009 (UTC). ::::::The way you hire soldier is really different if you play for the first time or subsequent play. If it's your first playthrough, you will probably hire based on varied requirement, I based sole on HP of the soldier. But now, I'll plan a head of time which soldiers I'll get before starting the game, first deciding how many soldier of each Arts I needed, then look at their Max Stats/Weapon (since you will get different damage with different weapon), followed by requirement for recruit. Sarmu 02:09, 11 February 2009 (UTC) Just to add, If it's your first time, you likely interested only to tiers currently available, on subsequent play you want the whole soldier list in one table (or at most seperated by arts) so you can decided who to recruit Sarmu 02:16, 11 February 2009 (UTC) ::Ok, how about something like this for each tier? (test)_Soldiers_Tier_1 ::Needs the colour coding for races explained, and the yellow needs to be paler, but it's officially nearly 4:30am and I'm too tired to work that out. Some sort of box at the top. With some other sort of box at the bottom for links to other tiers. ::Data removed from the table will have to go to the (sigh) individual soldier page. ::Ferret37 04:28, 11 February 2009 (UTC). :::An individual soldier page isn't a bad thing! I like lots of pages ^_^ At least then we have somewhere to put the items that the soldiers will require too. As for the page your created, I like it, but I agree with the colour coding Andrealinia970 21:08, 13 February 2009 (UTC) :::::: I've been looking and trying different colours, I just can't comeup with a colour that I think it's good Sarmu 21:11, 13 February 2009 (UTC) :::::::: I quite like how it is now. It just needs explaining Andrealinia970 21:46, 13 February 2009 (UTC) When Available There might be some error on when the soldier's are available. *Tier 6 - might be available after the boat event at Nagapur *Tier 7 - might be available after entering the Aqueducts So check that when you at that stage of the game Sarmu 18:07, 16 February 2009 (UTC) : Tier 7 - jep. Merthos 19:54, 16 February 2009 (UTC) I'll check Tier 6 after this quest, I've just finished the David's meeting in Nagapur Andrealinia970 21:31, 16 February 2009 (UTC) :: Tier 6 was available after the meeting at Nagapur and before I went to the castle to trigger Nest of Eagles on the map. Andrealinia970 21:44, 16 February 2009 (UTC) Max Stats I just noticed the max stats section of this and was wondering if that's something we'd want in an off-wiki database? I find it rather confusing to look at and thing it should be make a bit nicer to look at if we had one here instead. Anyone elses views? Andrea 12:09, 21 March 2009 (UTC) :That was something I compiled long time ago, If you can get all the info into a table in this wiki, then it would be great Sarmu 12:35, 21 March 2009 (UTC) Should probably be on the soldiers' individual pages too, but yes, a table would be nice (probably best split by arts). Lots missing though. How difficult is it going to be to get the missing info? Actually, how do you know when a soldier has reached max stats? Obviously they stop increasing, but that's kind of hard to spot considering how slowly they can go up. Ferret37 12:54, 21 March 2009 (UTC) :Well they do stop at some stage, if you stats grind from start, you have many BR's to determine if you've reached max stats. I've reached max stats at around BR 65 (probably earlier), and they haven't gained any stats since. There is about 40% of all soldiers in that database. I don't think it's really possible to collect all data, since you can only level so many per play. Sarmu 13:10, 21 March 2009 (UTC) Accessories My soldiers have all accessories not listed so far - Deluxe Bracelet and Royotiette. Like the leaders I'm fairly sure that they will take any item better their current once you have reached the required BR. - Merthos 19:23, 5 May 2009 (UTC) Weapon Upgrades Do soldiers ask for weapons just as leaders do? If I craft an upgraded weapon that is in their upgrade tree, will they ask for it? 13:38, 22 May 2009 (UTC) Nope Sarmu 13:43, 22 May 2009 (UTC) PC weapon upgrades I noticed that they seem to have different upgrade paths in the PC version, leading some of them to learn Weapon Arts if trained enough. Should we include the data on their separate pages? I know that Mayfield changes from the Spatha path to the Bluesteel eventually, and that Mattis goes from the Commander's Bludgeon->Excellent Konbo->Blackjack, ending at Superlative Blackjack. Many of them end at the Damascene/Mithril/etc. customizations as well.-- 02:36, February 14, 2010 (UTC)